The recent PA Gun Rally in Hrrisburg the state Capitol

Post anything and everything related to guns here...
pokerkid
Site Admin
Posts: 7781

The recent PA Gun Rally in Hrrisburg the state Capitol

Post#1 » Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:19 am

Friends:

This is the story that appeared in my local paper today, featured
with a graphic of Eustus's "hang Cruz. . ." sign which I thought
was quite good. I maintain that without that sign, the rally
would have gotten substantially less coverage. Some RKBA folks
are condemning it, but I think it helped rescue what would have
been a non-event from oblivion.

Image

This story will also help explain to you why I regarded Cruz's HB 760
as being as helpful to the RKBA cause in PA, as the attack on Pearl
Harbor was helpful to Winston Churchill's cause in Europe.

--Axxxxxxx

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Pro-gun supporters fire back at Capitol rally


By ALISON HAWKES
phillyBurbs.com

HARRISBURG -- Gun rights advocates descended Tuesday on the Capitol in an effort to further a loaded debate about which direction lawmakers should
aim the state's gun laws.

The rally in support of a package of legislation strengthening gun owner
rights came after the large-scale rebuke of a bill introduced recently
by a Philadelphia lawmaker to require owners to register their firearms
annually with a $10 per gun fee, a recent photograph and fingerprint.

Democratic Rep. Angel Cruz's bill set off the worst fears of gun owners,
even though it has not had a single hearing in a House committee and was
proclaimed "dead in the water" by leading House Democrats.

Still, in a show of anger, a group of gun rights advocates unfurled a
banner Tuesday on the Capitol Rotunda steps that read: "Rep. Cruz should
be hung from the tree of liberty for treasonous acts against the
Constitution."

Soon after, an event organizer asked that the banner be taken down.

Hours later, the Pennsylvania Legislative Black Caucus said it
considered the banner a "death threat" against Cruz because it was
"urging the lynching of a state House member." The caucus was reporting
the incident to the state police.

Alan Kiser of Warren County said he was "disgusted" by Cruz and believed
the six-year lawmaker should be impeached.

"You take an oath of office to defend and support and obey the
Constitution, and then they propose legislation like this that flies
directly in the face of the Constitution," Kiser said while holding the
banner.

Cruz later said he didn't expect his bill to become a focal point of the
gun rights coalition.

"They don't understand Philadelphia, and I don't understand the whole
entire state of Pennsylvania," Cruz said. "We live in two different
worlds, and I have not visited yours and you have not visited mine."

But handgun control advocates, too, have distanced themselves from Cruz
and are saying his bill might have hurt their cause.

A spokeswoman for Rep. Dwight Evans, a Philadelphia Democrat and leader
among House Democrats who has worked for years to restrict the
proliferation of illegal handguns, blamed Cruz for blowing up a
sensitive issue.

Spokeswoman Johnna Pro said Evans has worked carefully to build support
for bills limiting handgun purchases to one per month and mandating the
reporting of lost or stolen handguns.

Those proposals and others were part of an expansive debate last year in
the House, which held a full day's hearing on gun proposals -- both pro
and con on gun control -- in response to Philadelphia's record number of
murders.

"We have worked very hard to temper our language to talk about this in
terms of crime and as a commonsense issue," Pro said. "[Cruz's] House
Bill 760 did nothing but play into extremist fears and rhetoric
promulgated by the [National Rifle Association]."

The House Judiciary Committee is scheduled to hold a hearing Thursday on
the one-handgun-per-month and the lost and stolen handgun bills. But the
House has no immediate plans to push gun control measures forward under
a new Democratic majority. The House Democratic leadership sent out a
message in advance of Tuesday's rally clarifying that the Cruz bills and
other gun control measures are not part of the party's agenda.

"There is no caucus position on [gun control]," said Tom Andrews,
spokesman for House Democratic Leader Bill DeWeese.

Tuesday's pro-gun rally was bipartisan, though if there was one clear
distinction among the nearly two dozen lawmakers who gathered, it was
their rural origin. As a pushback to the handgun-control proposals, they
seek to advance measures that would eliminate background checks for
subsequent gun purchases, prohibit the state police from retaining
records of handgun sales, and allow emergency licenses to carry a gun
for someone in imminent danger.

Rep. Jesse White, a Washington County Democrat, said he is introducing a
bill that would require law enforcement to provide the evidence backing
up a denied gun license.

"The overwhelming majority of gun owners are not criminals," White said.
"They're not madmen and they shouldn't be treated as such."

Supporters included sportsmen groups and Larry Pratt, executive director
of the national Gun Owners of America.

"What you're really looking at when you're looking at gun control is a
coup d'etat," Pratt said. "We're here to say no more coup d'etat. We
don't want to be a banana republic."

Also notably present was Sen. Robert Regola, a Westmoreland County
Republican who has been charged with improperly storing a handgun and
then lying to authorities who were trying to investigate why his
14-year-old neighbor killed himself on July 22 with the lawmaker's 9 mm
weapon.

Regola said his pro-gun position has not changed since the incident.

"I believe in the right to bear arms," he said. "Those are my values,
and I'll never get away from my values."

Despite all the fanfare, Pro said Evans' office is still attempting to
build majority support for handgun control measures, with fresh examples
of why they're needed.

"The shootings at Virginia Tech, Duquesne University, and the killings
in Philadelphia -- if that doesn't say to people we need to have a
discussion about this issue, then I don't know what will," she said.

*Alison Hawkes can be reached at 717-705-6330 or
**ahawkes@calkins-media.com* <mailto:ahawkes@calkins-media.com>*.*

April 25, 2007 3:43 AM

pokerkid
Site Admin
Posts: 7781

PA rep Cruz should be hung for his treason to the Constituti

Post#2 » Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:21 am

PA rep Cruz should be hung for his treason to the Constitution said the pro-gun banner at yesterdays rally, which was featured on the front page of the lamestream newspaper.
pk

Gun Rights Advocates Rally in Harrisburg

HARRISBURG, Pa. (AP) -- Two participants in a gun-rights rally Tuesday at
the Capitol held up a banner calling for a Philadelphia lawmaker to be "hung
from the tree of liberty." Black lawmakers denounced the message as racist
and "a terroristic threat," and demanded a police investigation.

The banner said Rep. Angel Cruz, a Democrat of Puerto Rican descent who is
sponsoring legislation to require gun registration and a $10-a-gun annual
fee, "should be hung from the tree of liberty for treasonous acts against
the constitution."

Rep. Thaddeus Kirkland, chairman of the Legislative Black Caucus, said at a
news conference that the banner was "an act of racism, an act of hatred, an
act of bigotry and a terroristic threat on the life of a colleague."

"No one has the right to call for the lynching of another human being - no
one," he said.

Paul Estus, of Ridgway, one of two men who held up the banner, said during
the morning rally that the lynching tree was "just a figure of speech."

"You've got to make a stand," he said.

Rep. Jewell Williams, chairman of the Democrats' Philadelphia delegation,
threatened a boycott on legislative business unless leaders of both parties
agree to a policy or procedure to ban threatening signs from the Capitol.

"They said they're going to address it," Williams said.

Rep. Daryl Metcalfe, R-Butler, an organizer of the rally, condemned the
banner as "not appropriate," and was later among a handful of lawmakers who
criticized it on the House floor.

"It's very appropriate," said Alan Kiser, of Warren, who held the banner
along with Estus. "If they don't think that this is appropriate, they
wouldn't think our founding fathers were appropriate."

A spokesman for the Capitol Police, Edward Myslewicz, said the department
was unaware of the banner but would "follow up" if it receives a complaint.
Kirkland, D-Delaware, said a letter would be sent to the state police late
Tuesday.

Cruz's proposal was on the minds of many of the hundreds of gun-rights
advocates who packed the Capitol Rotunda to hear a group of state lawmakers,
mostly Republicans, advocate proposals to expand those rights.

Cruz has said he introduced his bill to address escalating gun violence in
Philadelphia, where 128 homicides already this year is on pace for the
city's highest murder rate in a decade.

But gun owners in Pennsylvania are well organized and well-connected
politically, claiming strong support from legislative leaders - and
rank-and-file - of both parties in the General Assembly.

Cruz's bill has virtually no chance of passing, and many at the rally
bitterly opposed it.

"Criminals will not tell you how many guns they have and pay a tax on it,"
said Charles McKelly, a 69-year-old retiree from Hershey. He said the
proposal would cost him a substantial sum to pay fees for the weapons he
keeps for hunting, clay-pigeon shooting and self-defense.

The event was organized and dominated by Republicans, although some
Democratic lawmakers participated.

Rep. Dick Stevenson, R-Mercer, proposed allowing those with valid
concealed-weapons permits to buy guns without having to go through the
criminal-background checks currently required of all gun purchasers.

Metcalfe said he wants to eliminate a gun-sales database maintained by the
Pennsylvania State Police and allow people who can show they are in
"imminent danger" to be quickly issued temporary permits to carry concealed
weapons.

Positions on gun control among House Democrats run the gamut, said Tom
Andrews, a spokesman for House Majority Leader Bill DeWeese, D-Greene.
DeWeese has promised to consign Cruz's bill "to oblivion."

Despite overwhelming opposition in the House, Cruz said he is standing by
the bill. Four of five co-sponsors have already withdrawn their support.

"It's my bill and I am not running from it," Cruz said. "A good legislator
dances to the song that he chose."



By MARK SCOLFORO
Associated Press Writer
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/ ... TE=DEFAULT
carried by the pittsburgh tribune...
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/ ... 4-22-18-02

carried by the times tribune Scranton...
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/ ... TE=DEFAULT

carried by chambersburg paper...
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/ ... TE=DEFAULT

philly daily news carried both versions of scolforo's coverage...
http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/n ... pitol.html
and
http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/n ... ching.html

http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/ ... 35822.html

Gettysburg times...
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/ ... TE=DEFAULT

Penn live carried both versions...
http://www.pennlive.com/ap/stories/inde ... topstories
And
http://www.pennlive.com/ap/stories/inde ... topstories

erie times...
http://www.goerie.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art ... 6/70424019
centre daily... http://www.centredaily.com/129/story/77685.html

Notice anything about the independent journalism coverage? Oh, it seems that
it's the AP writer/editorialists who get ahead of the curve and the lazy
local sob's parrot it.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here's at least something different...
Gun owners rally against proposed state restrictions
Tuesday, April 24, 2007

By Tom Barnes, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

HARRISBURG -- Hundreds of gun owners rallied in the state Capitol rotunda
today against any new legislation aimed at "gun control,'' especially a bill
proposed by Rep. Angel Cruz, D-Philadelphia, to require gun owners be
fingerprinted and pay a registration fee of $10 per handgun they own.

The bill has almost no support in the House, even among Democrats, but the
show of force by gun owners and sportsmen, who are numerous throughout the
state, ensured it won't be coming up for a vote any time soon.

Two leaders of the rally were Rep. Daryl Metcalfe, R-Cranberry, and Kim
Stolfer of Allegheny County, leader of Firearms Owners Against Crime. Mr.
Stolfer said "law abiding gun owners'' shouldn't be subjected to unwarranted
government interference and bureaucracy in a misguided effort to keep
criminals from getting access to guns.

The protesters also opposed other bills which would ban the sale of assault
weapons in Pennsylvania and limit a person to buying only one gun a month.
Mr. Stolfer said district attorneys and judges should take a harder line in
prosecuting criminals who use guns and in sentencing them to long jail
terms, rather than burdening legitimate sportsmen and gun owners with
unnecessary laws.
More details in tomorrow's Pittsburgh Post-Gazette.
http://www.postgazette.com/pg/07114/780531-100.stm

remains to be seen whether there appear more details tomorrow in other
publications

pokerkid
Site Admin
Posts: 7781

Can carry weapon IN OPLAIN SITE in our state of PA

Post#3 » Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:23 am

No Concealed Carry permit required.
pk


*Packing heat in plain view*
http://local.lancasteronline.com/11/30957

*Surprise. In Pennsylvania and 43 other states, any law-abiding resident 18
and older can carry a loaded handgun on his hip in plain view to shopping
malls, restaurants and on strolls down the street. No permits required, no
questions asked. You thought you needed a permit for that? Nope, only if you
conceal the gun.*

By AD CRABLE, Outdoor Trails
Lancaster New Era

Published: Apr 24, 2007 12:18 PM EST
*LANCASTER COUNTY, Pa - *The security guards at Park City mall don't carry
guns, but Patrick Miller packs heat on his hip in plain view when he strolls
amid the shoppers with his family.

Miller, 30, of Atglen, has a permit to carry a concealed weapon, but he has
worn his loaded semi-automatic 9 mm handgun in the open to dozens of
restaurants, sporting events, his church, movies -- almost everywhere he goes
in his leisure time.

Most people who even notice the gun on his waist assume he's a law
enforcement officer.

Most don't know -- and many likely will be shocked -- to learn that any
law-abiding citizen over the age of 18 in Lancaster County can wear a loaded
firearm in public.

No permits are required -- you only need one if you plan on concealing your
gun.

That's a throwback to pioneer and Wild West days when only people thought to
be cowardly or up to no good hid their guns in public.

"Open carry," as it's called by guns-rights advocates, is a long-established
basic right that's existed since frontier days.

Only six, mostly Southern, states have moved to restrict that right -- and
those were largely racist actions to keep African-Americans from arming
after the Civil War, open-carry groups say.

There are a few places in Pennsylvania where you can't walk around with a
visible, loaded handgun, such as in schools, courthouses, state parks and
the Capitol. In Philadelphia, you can open carry if you have a license to
carry a firearm.

Though there is hardly a gun-carrying shopper in every supermarket in
Lancaster County, open-carry gunholders may be increasingly exercising their
right here and around the country.

There are between 18,000 and 20,000 Lancaster County residents with permits
to carry a concealed firearm -- that's about one in every 25 county
residents.

However, many permit holders don't carry -- they just want to exercise their
right, observes Mark Reese, chief deputy Lancaster County sheriff.

Since there are no records kept, no one knows how many people open carry
guns in public here. Reese thinks not too many "because they know they would
be hounded every step of the way."

Even those that do carry often have the guns on their hips mistaken for cell
phones.

***

The right to carry firearms issue has been spotlighted by last week's
shootings at Virginia Tech.

Guns-rights advocates, including former Mountville resident Michael
Stollenwerk, have pushed bills in the Virginia legislature the last couple
years that would forbid colleges from preventing students 21 and older with
permits to carry concealed handguns on campus.

Virginia Tech officials, in particular, successfully lobbied to beat back
such bills and to keep guns off campus. Tech promises to expel any students
who bring their handguns to school.

After the defeat of one of the bills, Virginia Tech vice president Larry
Hincker told the Roanoke Times, "I'm sure the university community is
appreciative of the General Assembly's efforts because this will help
parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on campus."

In a letter to the editor chastising a Virginia Tech student graduate
student who thought his basic rights were being abridged, Hincker said, "The
writer would have us believe that a university campus, with tens of
thousands of young people, is safer with everyone packing heat. Imagine the
continual fear of students in that scenario. We've seen that fear here, and
we don't want to see it again."

Would the scenario have been any different in Blacksburg last week if
students with permits hadn't been barred from having guns?

"By lobbying against a common sense bill...the Virginia Tech administration
virtually ensured that students would be caught in a victim disarmament
zone," offers Stollenwerk, 44, co-founder of the
Opencarry.org<http://www.opencarry.org/>Web site and now studying to
be an attorney at Georgetown University.

"There's a good chance that somebody in that building, had the rule not been
so draconian, might have been carrying that day and been able to disrupt
that attack.

"We shouldn't have gun bans anywhere where there isn't real security."

Adds John Pierce, Stollenwerk's Opencarry.org co-founder from Bristol, Va.,
"The (mass murderer) Cho's of this world are already going to be armed. The
real question is what can we, as good guys, do to protect ourselves."

***

So why do people like Stollenwerk and Miller insist on carrying a gun in
public?

Miller, who is co-owner of a pole barn manufacturing company in Atglen, grew
up a Mennonite, a religion well known for its pacifism. He has since
switched churches.

When he started a family, Miller says he felt a duty to protect his family.
"I really feel there's no one as responsible as I am for the well-being of
my family," he says. "The police can't be at all places at all times.

"I'm confident it's a deterrent to have an armed populace."

The shootings of the Amish schoolchildren at Nickel Mines also weighed on
him.

Last fall, the father of two went through a background check and obtained a
permit to carry a concealed weapon.

Sometimes he carries his handgun -- one very similar to the one used by the
Virginia Tech mass murderer -- under a jacket or in an ankle holster.

But many times he carries his gun in plain view on his hip, something he
needs no permission for.

He uses a holster that's designed so that only the wearer can lift out the
gun. A person diving for the gun from an angle, for example, would be
foiled.

He says he's not trying to make a statement or make people around him
uncomfortable. But he thinks carrying a weapon is a prudent thing to do and
it's his basic right.

Occasionally, he gets some strange stares while standing in line at a store,
"but mostly people don't say boo about it because they assume I must have
some reason.

"People up to no good don't walk around with a weapon on their hip," he
reasons.

He's never been stopped and questioned by a cop.

Miller doesn't wear his gun into banks. He doesn't open carry in crowded
places where he would be rubbing up against people.

At work, he usually wears his gun concealed because he doesn't want to risk
offending a customer.

But most of the time he prefers to open carry. If he is told by someone that
they object to him wearing a loaded gun, he attempts to speak clearly and
calmly about his beliefs.

"I'm certainly not a guy with a bad case of paranoia," he says, "but I do
recognize we live in a kind of unpredictable environment."

He says he has never come close to drawing his gun and would go out of his
way to avoid using it.

"I decided early on that property in general is not worth a life," he says.
"I would not draw on a guy stealing my car, for example. But if someone
comes into my home..."

Opencarry.org co-founder Pierce is a software developer with three children.

He has been open carrying for about 10 years "for self defense -- even the
safest areas still have crime."

A second reason he open carries, he says, "is because it actually is a right
in many states, most of whose residents have no idea it exists."

The group sells a t-shirt that says, "Oops, my civil rights are showing."
Seeing people carrying guns in a nonconfrontational way gets people to
recognize the practice as legal and encourages them "to think about the
liberty and foundation aspects of our country," Pierce says.

"We are not vigilantes. We are not looking to be any kind of heroes. We
advocate personal responsibility."

Adds Stollenwerk, "It's one of those rights if you don't exercise it, sooner
or later someone is going to take it away. Open carry is about getting your
gun rights out of the closet."

CONTACT US: acrable@lnpnews.com <http://www%2Eacrable@lnpnews.com/>


www.neardeathexperiments.com - Survival According to Darwinism
"Every normal man must, at times, be tempted to spit on his hands, hoist the
black flag and begin slitting throats."

pokerkid
Site Admin
Posts: 7781

catch the replay on PCN

Post#4 » Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:24 am

Exxxxxxxxx writes:

ACTUALLY ANDY, the 'whole' rally was BROADCAST,via tape, on the
"PCN" TV network!

HERE WAS THE SCHEDULE FOR YESTERDAY for the Pennsylvania Cable
Network (please ALSO note a "hastily" put-together response by
the PA black caucus, in response to the signage at the rally, as
being racist)

BTW...THIS PROGRAM (and the balck caucus response), will air
AGAIN TODAY @10AM It's on COMCAST CHANNEL 75 in the Local
viewing area(Levittown/Morrisville/Yardley/Langhorne)

Hope this helps?

Do you want me to record this show for you? Just ask, and I will
:-)

---Exxxxxxxxx
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
TUESDAY, APRIL 24, 2007
7:00 PM "To The Best of My Knowledge" - LIVE
Graham Spanier, Penn State University President

8:00 PM Right to Bear Arms
Rep. Daryl Metcalfe, R-Butler County

8:35 PM Response to "Right to Bear Arms" Rally
PA Legislative Black Caucus

8:55 PM Paid Sick Leave
Rep. Marc Gergley, D-Allegheny County

9:05 PM PA State Association of Township Supervisors Convention
Kathleen McGinty, PA Environmental Protection Secretary
Fred Reddig, Governor's Center for Local Government Services

9:50 PM Domestic Violence Fatalities
PA Coalition Against Domestic Violence

10:10 PM Transportation Funding
PA Senate Transportation Committee

11:40 PM Right to Bear Arms
Rep. Daryl Metcalfe, R-Butler County

12:15 AM Response to "Right to Bear Arms" Rally
PA Legislative Black Caucus

12:35 AM Paid Sick Leave
Rep. Marc Gergley, D-Allegheny County

12:45 AM Domestic Violence Fatalities
PA Coalition Against Domestic Violence

1:10 AM PA State Association of Township Supervisors Convention
Kathleen McGinty, PA Environmental Protection Secretary
Fred Reddig, Governor's Center for Local Government Services

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Axxxxxxxxxcomments:

You forgot to mention that the Neshaminy School District School
Board meeting is also broadcast on Comcast. I suspect that on a
per capita basis, its ratings are similar.

Sorry for being a wise-ass about this, but I'll retell my own
story of appearing on behalf of the RKBA on PCN some years back,
and, deliberately not giving the RKBA community a heads-up to
watch me. To this day I have not encountered a single person who
saw the show. It was a call-in talk show, and I was on with a
state representative. In a state of nearly 12 million people, we
had periods that would have been dead air (on a hot-button
issue!) if the moderator hadn't made conversation. I.e., minutes
without any callers.

I'll also recall with other listmembers when WE did a cable TV
show, that was DAMN GOOD. Didja ever see it? Ever meet anyone
who did?

But, thanks for telling me, because coincidentally I read your
message just as the show was coming on -- a "head-up." And, I
wouldn't have known what channel PCN was on, otherwise. At the
moment I've been listening for maybe 10 minutes, and most of the
speakers have been doing a good job at saying entirely
predictable things, including the usual suspects kissing the
asses of legislators who don't deserve it.

Two observations: The rally was contained in the Rotunda, i.e.,
it wasn't very big; and the showing of it on PCN was apparently
sponsored by Darryll Metcalfe (credits at the end) so it was
campaign shtick for him.

When I talk about "coverage" I'm talking about the kind that
Joe Sixpack is likely to encounter on his way home from work,
or when he flops down in front of the TV before/after dinner.
I saw none of that. Were I the average shmoe, I wouldn't have
known about this rally until I saw my newspaper this morning --
and THAT was thanks to the "Hang Cruz. . ." sign, not to the
erudite comments of our friends.

--Axxxxxxxx

pokerkid
Site Admin
Posts: 7781

PA REp Cruz wants to take the 1st amendment as well as the 2

Post#5 » Thu Apr 26, 2007 11:27 pm

Deuchebag Druz is just the latest IDIOT tool, the shapers are using. Hes an idiot like McCarthy that doesnt have a f-ing clue as to many of the parts of the bill she suposedly wrote. I wonder which kosher nostra REALLY wrote it for her?
pk

Angel Cruz not only wants to strip away our Second Amendment Rights but also our First.

http://www.thebulletin.us/site/printerF ... d=18247777

The gunowners who visited Angel Cruz confronted him on his breaking his oath
of office. Cruz called security to have them escorted out of his office.
Cruz doesn't understand that everyone there would protect his sorry a--
against anyone who would want to cause him harm and he had them thrown out.

Diana Ebril referred to several dozen in Harrisburg when there were several
hundred. I'd say close to a thousand.

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp ... 0425a.html

It was a great day in Harrisburg. The 'militia' was well represented.

I have photos of both signs which I will email out after I get my film
developed.

Could someone send me Mike's email please.

Judy Brown

PA Coordinator Second Amendment Sisters http://www.2asisters.org
Self-defense is a basic human right.

PA Republican Assembly Board Member http://www.pagopwing.com “The
Republican Wing of the Republican Party”

www.pafairtax.org

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest